In another thread "The Spider" talks about "realistic" or "gritty" westerns. What era do you think made the most realistic western movies. Would you say 30s and 40s of the Hoot Gibson era or the modern westerns such as UNFORGIVEN and the Clint Eastwood style westerns. Smiley

I don't know and I don't care. I have no use at all for "realistic" or "gritty" westerns.
Give me the un-realistic, totally fictional Hollywood west. Give me the completely un-gritty west of the Saturday afternoon matinee. The west of Roy and Hoppy and Johnny Mack and Battlin' Bob and all the rest of the posse. I live "real", I don't need it in my entertainment. I watch old movies because they're way more fun than "real"
Bruce

In many ways, I have to agree with El Shaitan... the graphic bullet hits with blood spurting out are not my cup of tea however well they are produced. The Wild Bunch is a perfect example of this.......directed by Sam Peckinpah and starring William Holden,Ernest Borgnine, Robert Ryan, Edmond O'Brien, Warren Oates, Ben Johnson, Strother Martin, L.Q. Jones, Albert Dekker and Dub Taylor. All of these actors were in classic westerns of the old school, but this time we were "treated" to slow motion bullet hits and the most graphic blood letting ever seen. This may be a classic, but I will take John Wayne, Hoppy, Gene, Roy and all the rest of the B-Westerns over these for repeated viewings.

I am definitely in favor of the westerns from the 30's and 40's. Even those of the 50's. I can think of two Henry Fonda westerns, possibly three, that I'll take over any of "The Wild Bunch" type films: "The Ox-Bow Incident" "My Darling Clementine" and "Once Upon The West." And, of course, I have to add The Duke's "Stagecoach" along with the Saturday B-Westerns to the mix.
Good question. Smiley.

So far as I'm concerned, there never was a good "realistic" western made. I like the tough Randolph Scott ones and the action-packed B-westerns, and of course the classic Duke movies, but Clint Eastwood and his ilk? Yuck.

I think I like the early 50's the best. Shane, High Noon, Bend in the River and John Wayne's great western The Seachers, Great Question;
There is one western in the 30's that I like very much, The Big Trail with Wayne. I hope that it is Widescreen when it is released on DVD in a few months. I have not liked too many of the new westerns, but Silverado was very enjoyable. Even though the Wild Bunsch had a lot of Blood, it was still a great movie

I enjoyed Dances With Wolves,Maverick, Mask of Zorro, Tombstone, Wyatt Earp and the most recent Last of the Mohicans. I thought Pale Rider, Unforgiven and Deadman were thought provoking. El Dorado is one of my favorite Wayne films. Well made older B's ( Hoppy and Gene) I enjoy but those Monogram and PRC and Lone Star features are as dull as grandma's silver plated butter knife. I enjoyed Jimmy Stewart's realistic westerns of the 50's.

Tony, did you know that El Dorado was a thinly veiled remake of Rio Bravo by Howard Hawks who directed both films? When Wayne read the script, he commented to Hawks that it was the "same damned movie." Hawks answered him by saying "the audience will never know."
One other funny thing is that Mitchum forgot which leg he supposedly had injured and switched his crutch to the other leg and Wayne even comments in the film that he can't remember which leg was hurt. The movie still is a lot of fun because of the star turns in it and Hawk's direction.

You can add the tv miniseries "Lonesome Dove" on my all time favorite westerns. In my not so humble opinion, it is one of the great westerns bar none.

I'm gonna throw a monkey wrench in here and give my own technical definition of "realistic" and "unrealistic" westerns.
To my, an "unrealistic" western is of the b movie type where the characters always have a clean shirt and a laugh and nobody drinks anything harder than a sasparillo. I'm talking about your Roy Rogers/Gene Autry/Hopalong Cassidy type of western. Kiddie westerns I call them and I have to confess, I'm not too fond of that type.
"Realistic" westerns to me are much more dramatic. They have less to do with how much actual blood is shown and more to do with the type of attitude. I'd call movies like The Searchers and Shane "realistic" westerns simply because of their more mature attitudes. They're the type of thing where the hero (usually played by John Wayne) is a bad man, the type you don't want to mess with. Take the Searchers for instance. Wayne plays a very dark character in that film. He even wants to kill his niece because she went Indian. The final shot of the film with him standing in the dark in the doorway away from the family is a haunting image because it says he's still a dark man and he always will be.
The so-called "Spaghetti" westerns can be very good when done right. The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly is as good a western as they come IMHO. The thing with the modern western is it's a mix between the spaghetti and the realistic style that Hollywood has done for a long time. For instance, Maverick and Mask of Zorro (possibly THE best Zorro movie ever) are more in line with Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. All three are "modern" westerns, but none of them is especially bloody (there is that scene with the head in the jar in Zorro). The Unforgiven, of course, harkens back to the Man With No Name movies. So you'll really get a mixed bag. Those who refuse to watch the modern western, like those who refuse to watch any modern movies, have no idea what they're missing. I say, if you can like High Noon, you might just like some of the stuff still done.
My personal favorite westerns:
Hondo
The Searchers
Shane (though the book was way better)
The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid
Nevada Smith
High Noon
The Magnificent Seven

While there are many westerns out there, that can be enjoyed on many levels... to me the absolute fun westerns are the ones that can be viewed over and over, and there is a place there for the "kiddie westerns." There are a lot of us out there that must be in our second childhood enjoying ole Hoppy, Gene, Roy and the rest of the gang. Many of the classic "adult" westerns are just great at taking elements from the Saturday Morning Matinee Westerns and embellishing them with bigger budgets, better directors and writers. They still owe a tip of the Stetson to the Republic/Gower Gulch pioneers.

Crimson Collector:
I couldn't have said it any better. You right about a second childhood. Last night their was absolutely nothing on TV that I cared to watch. So, up to trusty basement(In Florida basements are on the second floor) grab a Rocky Lane double feature and plop it into the machine and I'm in Seventh Heaven. I've really got to be in a certain mood to watch one of the "Adult Westerns" i.e., Red River or one of Clint Eastwood's westerns. Don't get me wrong, I like those westerns but if I want to be entertained for an hour or so I'll take one of the "Kiddie Westerns" anytime.
Barcroft

Howard Hawks with the Duke had another Rio Bravo-type movie in Rio Lobo only three years after El Dorado. I may be in the minority but El was my favorite with the great nighttime gun battles at the church, bars and the like and Robert Mitchum great turn as a drunk plus Arthur Hunnicutt and James Cann plus Ed (BHL) Asner.

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